Does Joe gotta go?
Like most of you, I love Joe and want him to finish with some dignity. One day I want him to step down, another day I think he should hang on no matter what. But the Northwestern game was the pits. Sometimes I think he and his staff are making things up without much thought. I knowt they were desperate to use Robinson, but letting Scott and Hunt languish on the sidelines was almost sinful. Robinson might be a good strong athlete, but he has no instinct for playing tailback. His spacing was all messed up. Plus those young tailbacks had been doing a pretty good job despite the poor line play.
There's another thing to look at, though. I know these guys are young, but I don't see them getting appreciably better down the road. Oh, they should have a winning season next year, but I can't envision seeing them being in the top 15 or 20 like Joe insists they'll be. I hope I'm wrong.
Personally, I think they're a bunch of losers, literally and figuratively. I don't think there's much internal fortitude, to use a cliche. Many of the experts insist the talent level is high, so it must come down to some sort of team character defect. Of course, the coaching staff did pick these guys.
Finally, do you realize how much these current players are despised by many former PSU players who are are doggedly loyal to Joe? Right or wrong, they mainly blame the players for the huge fall this year.
There's another thing to look at, though. I know these guys are young, but I don't see them getting appreciably better down the road. Oh, they should have a winning season next year, but I can't envision seeing them being in the top 15 or 20 like Joe insists they'll be. I hope I'm wrong.
Personally, I think they're a bunch of losers, literally and figuratively. I don't think there's much internal fortitude, to use a cliche. Many of the experts insist the talent level is high, so it must come down to some sort of team character defect. Of course, the coaching staff did pick these guys.
Finally, do you realize how much these current players are despised by many former PSU players who are are doggedly loyal to Joe? Right or wrong, they mainly blame the players for the huge fall this year.
"Talk low, talk slow, and don't talk too much."
-- John Wayne
-- John Wayne
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BillyWhiteShoesJohnson
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I say give JoePa one more year w/ complete power like he has now. I think most people agree he has the talent to have a very successful season next year and if it turns out poorly then i think we need 2 see someone else callin the shots in the Happy Valley. JoePa deserves a chance to go out as a winner, I know that no one wants 2 win more than he does. I mean lets face it, penn state football is not what it is w/o JoePa, so we owe him one or 2 more years before he is impeached.
Austin Scott needs 2 be the halfback, robinson needs 2 be a slot receiver or something, and mills needs 2 be the qb. Thats the key to success in my eyes. That puts all their best athletes on the field at one time, robinson is a bull, but he is not a good qb, hes inaccurate w/ an unorthodox throwing motion. Please find a linemen 2 block also. :evil:
Austin Scott needs 2 be the halfback, robinson needs 2 be a slot receiver or something, and mills needs 2 be the qb. Thats the key to success in my eyes. That puts all their best athletes on the field at one time, robinson is a bull, but he is not a good qb, hes inaccurate w/ an unorthodox throwing motion. Please find a linemen 2 block also. :evil:
Small Feeet, Small Feeet!
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old school
- Official BleacherCoach
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Take a look at the Penn State Roster and see how many players are actually from the great state of PA…you will be surprised. Back in the glory days “as south paw calls it” almost the entire team was made up of recruits from PA with a few coming from New Jersey, Ohio and New York. Go Back to your roots Joe and start recruiting were the real talent is PENNSYLVANIA.
I found this information on another message board
*********** I couldn't help noticing during the player intros - I love to see where the guys are from, and I hate the networks who won't tell us - that Penn State was starting only one Pennsylvania kid on defense against Northwestern. (I missed the offensive intro's.)
Are you kidding me? ONE? What the hell is this? I thought.
This isn't West Virginia, or Oregon, or Nebraska. They're small states that produce good football players, just not all they need to compete at the level they compete at, so they have to go out of state for talent.
No. This is Pennsylvania, for God's sake! While the decline of its industrial base means that it no longer ranks with the Californias, or Texases or Floridas as prime recruiting territory, the Keystone State is still up there with the Ohios, Michigans, Georgias and Illinoises.
What the hell is going on here? I thought, so I did a little digging, and found some interesting things: of the 116 kids listed on the Nittany Lions' roster, only 61 are Pennsylvanians. By contrast, of the 114 kids on the Ohio State roster, 89 are from Ohio. Of the PSU lettermen returning from 2002, the ratio is even worse: only 12 of 35 are Pennsylvanians, and of the 12, two of them are sons of coaches on the Penn State staff.
Pitt has more Pennsylvania kids starting in its secondary than Penn State does in its entire defense!
What is going on here?
Has the amount and quality of the state's talent declined that much? Did all those people leaving the state for work elsewhere take that many football-playing sons with them? Can it be that you just can't build a Big Ten power with Pennsylvania kids?
You mean to tell me that a staff can live in a state, a state the size of Pennsylvania, with 600 high schools playing football, and not come up with more than one kid capable of starting for them on defense?
I doubt it. Not when Oregon and Oregon State both can find Oregon kids who can start in the Pac-10. Not when there are Nebraska kids starting for Nebraska.
I won't even mention Mississippi or Alabama, football-mad small states that turn out far more than their share of good football players. You will see Mississippi kids - lots of them - starting for Ole Miss. Or Mississippi State. Or Southern Miss. You will find Alabama kids starting for Alabama. or Auburn. Or UAB.
(The practice of doing it with in-state kids goes back to John Vaught at Ole Miss and Bear Bryant at Bama. Yes, the Bear went out of state on occasion - he did okay with Joe Namath, a Pennsylvanian, and Ray Perkins, a Mississippian. But I do recall his saying something about wanting mostly Alabama kids on his team, because the Auburn game meant something special to a boy raised in Alabama - something that a kid from, say, Pennsylvania could never understand.)
True, Penn State has never had the hold on Pennsylvania kids that a Nebraska has on its native sons. Pennsylvania has a long, storied tradition of kids going elsewhere to play, a result of its high schools' turning out far more players than its own colleges could absorb. And Penn State itself has a long tradition of tapping adjacent states - New Jersey, New York, Maryland, and - yes - even Ohio - for good players. But as Penn State grew into a national power in the 1970s and 80s, it did begin to earn something of a right of first refusal on in-state blue-chippers. Not any more. While it is possible that Pennsylvania simply isn't producing the talent Penn State needs, it's also true that Penn State isn't keeping top-talent Pennsylvania kids home, either.
Jeff Smoker at Michigan State and Kevin Jones of Virginia Tech come to mind.
Perhaps Pennsylvania talent isn't what to used to be, and Penn State increasingly is forced to go out on the open market. But maybe the talent is still there, and Joe Pa's staff has grown fat and complacent, expecting to sit back and wait for the good Pennsylvania kids to come to them.
Either way, the reality can't be going down well with Pennsylvania high school coaches, a very proud, close-knit group, who have to be aware of this situation that I just stumbled on. Is it that their kids aren't good enough, or is Penn State dissing them by fishing too far from shore?
(Ironically, the lone Pennsylvanian starting on defense against Northwestern sprained his knee in the first half and missed the rest of the game. His replacement was from New Jersey.)
*********** Joe Pa has one guy calling the pass plays and another one calling the running plays. (Guess they flip a coin when they can't decide whether to run or pass.) After weeks of watching that offense of theirs, I've got to say it might be time for Joe to put the headphones on and find out what the hell's going on.
*********** I saw an awful lot of dropped passes in the Penn State-Northwestern game. Yes, they are two of the Big Ten's bottom feeders, but I'm sorry - those are scholarship athletes. Even at Penn State and Northwestern, they're the best of the best. I've seen plenty of kids who can catch anything thrown near them, but for some reason - usually because they're not quite fast enough or not quite big enough - the Division I schools pass on them. So how good must the kids they sign be?
Or are they signing them based on the measurable things - size and speed? Maybe it's time for recruiters to put a higher priority on pass-catching ability. And also for coaches to tell those receivers they already have to take those f--king gloves off and use the hands God gave them.
I found this information on another message board
*********** I couldn't help noticing during the player intros - I love to see where the guys are from, and I hate the networks who won't tell us - that Penn State was starting only one Pennsylvania kid on defense against Northwestern. (I missed the offensive intro's.)
Are you kidding me? ONE? What the hell is this? I thought.
This isn't West Virginia, or Oregon, or Nebraska. They're small states that produce good football players, just not all they need to compete at the level they compete at, so they have to go out of state for talent.
No. This is Pennsylvania, for God's sake! While the decline of its industrial base means that it no longer ranks with the Californias, or Texases or Floridas as prime recruiting territory, the Keystone State is still up there with the Ohios, Michigans, Georgias and Illinoises.
What the hell is going on here? I thought, so I did a little digging, and found some interesting things: of the 116 kids listed on the Nittany Lions' roster, only 61 are Pennsylvanians. By contrast, of the 114 kids on the Ohio State roster, 89 are from Ohio. Of the PSU lettermen returning from 2002, the ratio is even worse: only 12 of 35 are Pennsylvanians, and of the 12, two of them are sons of coaches on the Penn State staff.
Pitt has more Pennsylvania kids starting in its secondary than Penn State does in its entire defense!
What is going on here?
Has the amount and quality of the state's talent declined that much? Did all those people leaving the state for work elsewhere take that many football-playing sons with them? Can it be that you just can't build a Big Ten power with Pennsylvania kids?
You mean to tell me that a staff can live in a state, a state the size of Pennsylvania, with 600 high schools playing football, and not come up with more than one kid capable of starting for them on defense?
I doubt it. Not when Oregon and Oregon State both can find Oregon kids who can start in the Pac-10. Not when there are Nebraska kids starting for Nebraska.
I won't even mention Mississippi or Alabama, football-mad small states that turn out far more than their share of good football players. You will see Mississippi kids - lots of them - starting for Ole Miss. Or Mississippi State. Or Southern Miss. You will find Alabama kids starting for Alabama. or Auburn. Or UAB.
(The practice of doing it with in-state kids goes back to John Vaught at Ole Miss and Bear Bryant at Bama. Yes, the Bear went out of state on occasion - he did okay with Joe Namath, a Pennsylvanian, and Ray Perkins, a Mississippian. But I do recall his saying something about wanting mostly Alabama kids on his team, because the Auburn game meant something special to a boy raised in Alabama - something that a kid from, say, Pennsylvania could never understand.)
True, Penn State has never had the hold on Pennsylvania kids that a Nebraska has on its native sons. Pennsylvania has a long, storied tradition of kids going elsewhere to play, a result of its high schools' turning out far more players than its own colleges could absorb. And Penn State itself has a long tradition of tapping adjacent states - New Jersey, New York, Maryland, and - yes - even Ohio - for good players. But as Penn State grew into a national power in the 1970s and 80s, it did begin to earn something of a right of first refusal on in-state blue-chippers. Not any more. While it is possible that Pennsylvania simply isn't producing the talent Penn State needs, it's also true that Penn State isn't keeping top-talent Pennsylvania kids home, either.
Jeff Smoker at Michigan State and Kevin Jones of Virginia Tech come to mind.
Perhaps Pennsylvania talent isn't what to used to be, and Penn State increasingly is forced to go out on the open market. But maybe the talent is still there, and Joe Pa's staff has grown fat and complacent, expecting to sit back and wait for the good Pennsylvania kids to come to them.
Either way, the reality can't be going down well with Pennsylvania high school coaches, a very proud, close-knit group, who have to be aware of this situation that I just stumbled on. Is it that their kids aren't good enough, or is Penn State dissing them by fishing too far from shore?
(Ironically, the lone Pennsylvanian starting on defense against Northwestern sprained his knee in the first half and missed the rest of the game. His replacement was from New Jersey.)
*********** Joe Pa has one guy calling the pass plays and another one calling the running plays. (Guess they flip a coin when they can't decide whether to run or pass.) After weeks of watching that offense of theirs, I've got to say it might be time for Joe to put the headphones on and find out what the hell's going on.
*********** I saw an awful lot of dropped passes in the Penn State-Northwestern game. Yes, they are two of the Big Ten's bottom feeders, but I'm sorry - those are scholarship athletes. Even at Penn State and Northwestern, they're the best of the best. I've seen plenty of kids who can catch anything thrown near them, but for some reason - usually because they're not quite fast enough or not quite big enough - the Division I schools pass on them. So how good must the kids they sign be?
Or are they signing them based on the measurable things - size and speed? Maybe it's time for recruiters to put a higher priority on pass-catching ability. And also for coaches to tell those receivers they already have to take those f--king gloves off and use the hands God gave them.
"The old lessons (work, self-discipline, sacrifice, teamwork, fighting to achieve) aren't being taught by many people other than football coaches these days....." Paul "Bear" Bryant
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pepiepierson
- Freshman
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- Joined: August 26th, 2003, 12:21 pm
- Location: Woodbury, PA
NO ??
There is not even a question about should he stay or go. OF COURSE HE SHOULD STAY!! You can't just judge the coacheS, (PLURAL, Cause there is more than one coach coaching that team!) for the bad season. Accountability seems to be on no ones mind when they are winning but as soon as there is a bad season "Its the Coaches fault!"
He should STAY as long as he wants too!
He should STAY as long as he wants too!
I agree Pepie, it doesn't even matter what play they call because most likely the line will not hold long enough to run it. All the blame is being put on the coaches...how about just for once thinking that the players are not doing thier jobs. We don't see what goes on in practice every day, so who are we to tell them how to run the team when we watch them once a week?
"DERABASSEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!" - CPA
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southpaw
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Nice post old school!
The longer JoePa stays the farther Penn State slides- too the bottom of the big ten? with the IU's?
You JoePa worshippers out there don't come back next year and the year after when they win a few and get a bowl game and say everything is alright. I want to see the Penn State of the 70's and 80's when it wasn't if you were going to a bowl it was how big of a bowl game it was going to be.
PA has plenty of talent for Penn State to be a powerhouse again year after year. The Scott kid is a big time recruit but Joe won't play him. Penn State is getting hurt big time in recruiting by the resurgence of Pitt and the ascension of VA Tech and The Big Ten schools take some real good PA blue chippers, Michigan comes to mind.
Joe and his staff have to hit the pavement and get the PA kids to go to PSU to get back on top.
The longer JoePa stays the farther Penn State slides- too the bottom of the big ten? with the IU's?
You JoePa worshippers out there don't come back next year and the year after when they win a few and get a bowl game and say everything is alright. I want to see the Penn State of the 70's and 80's when it wasn't if you were going to a bowl it was how big of a bowl game it was going to be.
PA has plenty of talent for Penn State to be a powerhouse again year after year. The Scott kid is a big time recruit but Joe won't play him. Penn State is getting hurt big time in recruiting by the resurgence of Pitt and the ascension of VA Tech and The Big Ten schools take some real good PA blue chippers, Michigan comes to mind.
Joe and his staff have to hit the pavement and get the PA kids to go to PSU to get back on top.
"I'm your huckleberry"
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captain dean
- Official BleacherCoach
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Should Joe go? No way. This is the first time we have asked this in 50 some years. Give the man some credit. Even if there is a coaching change whos to say the new coach will be any better. Some schools programs have gone down the crapper because they cant get another good coach. I dont think the blame should automatically go to the coach. We have no idea whats going on inside the team. Nobody knows the players better than their coaches and i'm sure they're trying to do the right things.
Buzzards have to eat, same as worms.
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BillyWhiteShoesJohnson
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